Touching Death

About This Episode

Sally Dukes is a psychotherapist, educator, and writer whose work centers on the power of story as a path to healing. At age three, Sally underwent open-heart surgery to treat a congenital heart disorder — and during the procedure, she had a near-death experience that would shape the rest of her life.

The nickname "drummer girl" came from the way her heart beat so loudly before the surgery. What follows is a lifelong pilgrimage — from New York to India to a forest monastery in Burma to a Greek island — all in search of understanding what happened in that operating room. Mike and Sally talk about near-death experiences, the healing power of writing, resilience in the face of trauma, and the courage it takes to finally tell your own story.

Key Takeaways

1. Writing has always been her voice. Sally describes herself as "not very verbal" — writing was always a better form of expression, from high school journals to the memoir itself.
2. A near-death experience at age three shaped her entire life. During open-heart surgery, Sally experienced a dark tunnel, a brilliant light, and an overwhelming feeling of love — an experience she spent decades trying to understand.
3. The surgeon's elephant became a powerful symbol. When young Sally's nightmares wouldn't stop, her surgeon drew an elephant on a yellow notepad and told her to hang it over her bed. The elephant — keeper of memories, remover of obstacles — became a recurring motif in her life and her book.
4. The memoir was built from a lifetime of journal entries. Sally's younger self gave her older self a gift — decades of writing that, when collated, all pointed to the same search for truth.
5. Resilience matters more than the trauma. Sally hopes readers focus not on the trauma in her story, but on the resilience — and on the message that death is nothing to fear.
6. You don't need to look outside yourself for answers. After traveling the world seeking confirmation of her experience, Sally ultimately realized she already knew her truth.
7. Writing the book was cathartic — and freeing. Sally describes the process as "coming clean" — finally sharing a story she'd never told anyone, and feeling liberated by it.